Looking for Flathead for our pond

[Chasin 'eyes]

Anybody know where I could purchase some flayheads for our pond this spring. We have a bullhead problem and the G&P suggested a few flatties would help. Any info or help would be great.

[Chad]

Catch them... it'd be more fun!
Just make sure you get the official sign off from Jeff Blaser first (I'm not sure on the legalities). You can call him at 402-471-5435.

Hit any jettie on the MO and fish the downstream side with a small live goldfish on a circle hook with zero drag. Fish dusk (and several hours following) and dawn (and several hours preceding) for the best action. You should find some smallish flatties pretty easy. Toss them in a cooler with a bubbler and a few frozen water bottles for transport.

Remember, those flatties could live for 30 years and who knows, they may recruit in your pond. Plus, I know they love bass and gobble up MA bluegill like they are fry. What's your overall management objective?

[thedarkarcher]

indian cave will produce a bunch of small flatties from shore.

[holdemplyer]

Kevin, that is one purdy flattie!

[thedarkarcher]

you can catch those guys all day on crawlers at I.C.

[Chad]

Great picture, Dark!
Aren't flatheads just awesome predators?

[thedarkarcher]

Originally Posted by Chad

Great picture, Dark!
Aren't flatheads just awesome predators?

they are! i see them as nothing short of a trophy gamefish.

[Shorty]

I would stock more LMB (8-10" or bigger) rather than flatheads, once those flatheads get bigger none of the other fish in your pond will be safe from predation.

As far as dealing with the excessive bullheads numbers you can work on fishing them out by keeping everyone you catch, this could be a lot a fun for kids this summer. Or if you pond is relatively free of structure you could use a seine net to thin their numbers down.

[Chasin 'eyes]

Pond is about 15 acres so seining is out. Did keep a bunch this summer about(200) and the other people who fish have been doing the same. I plan on buying some LMB this spring to put in but we thought a few flatties (3-4) would help out as well.

[Shorty]

The flatheads will eventually get big enough to eat the biggest bass in your pond.

Gape : Body Size Relationship of Flathead Catfish

Our results show the relationship of total length to horizontal and vertical gape and the relationship of flathead catfish total length to the total lengths of ingestible-sized prey of different body shapes. Furthermore, comparisons of the body depth of three common fish species to the gape dimensions showed that no size of largemouth bass Micropterus salmoides, bluegill Lepomis macrochirus, or gizzard shad Dorosoma cepedianum would preclude predation by flathead catfish. Our results support the assumption that the flathead catfish is one of the least gape-limited piscivores.

[jarredbehrendt]

Stocking flat-heads into Prairie Rose turned that fishery around completely. That lake had turned into bullhead paradise, you would catch them on bare hooks. They put a kill only on bullheads there for about 3 years and during that time the bullheads became stunted but did not decrease in overall population. They then stocked flatheads, lots of them (16-29in size) and in about 2 years you couldnt catch a bullhead out of there. However, that lake is now the best LMB lake in the state, and the flatheads that are being caught out of it are in the 35-45lb range. Large predators= larger fish overall. Unless of course you would like to produce a bunch of genetically inferior bass, bluegill and yes bullheads.

[Shorty]

Here is some info on the "experimental" stocking of flatheads in Prairie Rose, looks like a 50% reduction in bullheads from the 1990 survey. Note that supplemental stockings of LMB were also done to control bullhead numbers, most of this was done in the late 1980's and early 1990's from what I can tell.

RESEARCH:

It's been 6 years since I have bass fished at Prairie Rose with my bass club, there is a reason we haven't been back since, the bass fishing wasn't all that good when it came catching numbers of LMB even though a few nice ones were caught.

Jarred, when was the last time you bass fished Prairie Rose?

[jarredbehrendt]

I dont usually bass fish, from the Dnr's creel surveys and from electrofishing the Rose has been shown to produce some very large fish. There may be a low number of small fish in there, but prior to the stockings you could not catch a bass out of there (let alone anything but bullhead) so I cannot conclusively say that the flatheads have lowered the bass population. If bass predation is your worry stock the flatheads in lower density, as far as I know flatheads have very limited reproductive abilities in lakes that are not connected to rivers (However, I havent seen a lot of research on this).

[Shorty]

The fishing reports that I could find on Prairie Rose mostly talk about the catfishing being good but I havn't been able to find out much about how the the bass fishing currently is. I can tell you that the last time our club bass fished it that most of the guys struggled to catch a 5 fish limit during the 8 hours of fishing.

The reason for my caution on stocking flatheads is that a 40 lb flattie can easily eat a 5 lb LMB or larger.

[suddawg]

After doing some research during a period where TA2D and I considered putting in some flatties in a 5 acre farm pond to help take care of a 5 inch crappie problem we were told bad idea. Mainly because the pond is just to small...once the flatties are through with the crappie they will eat everything else.

However, having a pond that's 3 times that big I would say having a few flatties in there wouldn't destroy the LMB fishery. However, that being said eventually once the bullheads are waining you can keep a few flatties that are caught.

Would the pond sustain some Muskie? Would Muskie take care of bullhead or would the Muskie go straight for LMB, Panfish?

SudDawg

[Shorty]

My guess is that an overabundance of bullheads (or channel catfish) keep the water fairly turbid which makes it more difficult for sight predators like muskie to do well. This turbidity also probably hinders BG reproduction and growth too.

Does this sound right Chasin eyes?


BTW, here is the 2008 Private Aquaculturist list, on page 2 Willies fish farm in Henderson lists that they have flatheads available.

http://www.ngpc.state.ne.us/fishing/pdfs/aqualist.pdf

[jarredbehrendt]

During the study they found that bass stocks had not been affected though: "standing stocks of LMB remained unaffected, bluegill stock increased substatially and channel catfish and crappie both decreased" Not to say that the LMB population will not be later affected but the stocking of 200-300 flatheads per year in a 200 acre lake is pretty substantial.

The depth and turbidity of the lake could definately be a factor, if its shallow and turbid there may not be a recovery plan that does not include renovation and silt removal.

[jarredbehrendt]

Shorty, do you have any research on the stocking of LMB and bullhead populations? I am curious because most of the information I have seen was on a combo of species. Bullhead are pretty slow so I dont see why other predators wouldnt be able to do the job.

[Shorty]

Originally Posted by jarredbehrendt

Shorty, do you have any research on the stocking of LMB and bullhead populations? I am curious because most of the information I have seen was on a combo of species. Bullhead are pretty slow so I dont see why other predators wouldnt be able to do the job.

I couldn't find anything on just LMB and BH, maybe the pointy headed one could weigh in on this topic.

[Chad]

Originally Posted by jarredbehrendt

Shorty, do you have any research on the stocking of LMB and bullhead populations? I am curious because most of the information I have seen was on a combo of species. Bullhead are pretty slow so I dont see why other predators wouldnt be able to do the job.

This was in In-Fisherman (I don't remember when and my recollection might be off a touch , but...), something like 75% of bullheads with their spines intact were spit out by LMB; only 25% were consumed. Perhaps the spines of the bullhead are a fairly effective defense mechanism against most predators, but flatheads don't care???

Daryl said as much to Sam last year and Sam had it in his signature line for awhile. Something about, "The Flatheads won't care. Chomp, swallow, burb."