trout and perch

FatMatt · 03-02-2008, 08:59 AM

There is a pond with both very nice perch...though not many and also has a large number of trout. For whatever reason the owner wants to get rid of the trout and keep the perch in it. My question is, which fish will eat the other if either will? Or do they "cohabitate" without any problems. Any help would be appreciated.

Aquaman · 03-02-2008, 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FatMatt

There is a pond with both very nice perch...though not many and also has a large number of trout. For whatever reason the owner wants to get rid of the trout and keep the perch in it. My question is, which fish will eat the other if either will? Or do they "cohabitate" without any problems. Any help would be appreciated.

My first question to ask you would be "Is there any reproduction of either species in this pond?"

If this pond is in Nebraska it is extremely unlikely that the trout reproduce, so they should be fairly easy to eradicate. The perch however, could be reproducing, in which case you could have lots of tiny perch, which I believe the trout might be preying upon. Let us know about how the fish are getting in there, i.e. annual stocking, periodic stocking, or natural reproduction and we can answer your question.

**Chad** · 03-02-2008, 09:23 AM

Welcome to the forum FatMatt!

As Bruce said, it would be helpful to know a little bit more about the pond. Things like Bruce asked:

1) Is there any reproduction of either species in this pond?
2) How are fish getting in there - i.e. annual stocking, periodic stocking, or natural reproduction?

It would also be helpful to know:

3) What other species (if any) are present?
4) What is the size and condition of the fish now?

Generally, it would not be a good idea to have only perch. They could populate to a point that Bruce alluded to where you have an abundance of tiny perch. From what I have read, they can be stocked with most other species. An interesting pond concoction (given you have the right water) might be trout, perch, and hybrid gills. Add feed and enjoy!

FatMatt · 03-03-2008, 07:32 PM

Thanks for the info guys! I do know that the trout are reproducing and are able to because of the amount of fresh ground water that comes from underground springs. The trout are all around 12-15 inches or there abouts, and the only perch that i have caught have been some of the nicest perch i have caught, well over 12 inches, i guess i did catch one smaller one. But as far as numbers go, none of us have caught near the number of perch as we have trout, although they are fun to catch and fight like crazy... i guess as a personal preference for all of us that fish the pond we would much rather eat the perch than the trout!

Aquaman · 03-03-2008, 08:33 PM

Certain trout species are more "piscivorous" than others. Brown trout are notorious for eating other fish. My belief is that in general a yellow perch is more likely to eat a small trout than vice versa. It all depends on the size of the predator and the size of the prey. If you catch a trout or perch of a certain length you can look at the mouth size for a fairly accurate determination of what size fish they can eat.

Judging by what you've said, if the trout density is higher, and if both species are reproducing, then the perch evidently aren't making much of a dent in the smaller trout.

My gut instinct says that in most ponds where trout reproduction occurs that you could simply harvest trout and control their numbers that way. Keep in mind that both species adapt extremely well to pelleted feed. Do you currently feed them? If not, and you trained them to feed you'd be amazed at how rapidly you could catch the trout using a pellet imitation. If you choose to try this I can give you more information on how to do this.

I will provide a link to another forum for you to view many different ways of capturing pellet trained fish.

Pellet deceptions - Pond Boss Forum

Frosch · 03-03-2008, 10:02 PM

FatMatt I don't have any real advice for you about the cohabitation of perch and trout. I would like to say though that I'm jealous of you for being able to fish a pond with trout and perch.

Aquaman you thought you could hide that link from didn't you....

Look out TR CCs here I come.

laughingwatr · 03-03-2008, 10:08 PM

I have a small pond created by a dam on a small stream with gravel beds and whole works and I get no trout reproduction. It would be HIGHLY unlikely that there would be any trout reproduction in a pond, it's hard enough to get it in a stream in Nebraska. A lot of people would be very happy to have a pond that would keep trout. If you would start keeping the trout it would eventually put a pretty good dent in them.

Aquaman · 03-03-2008, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frosch

FatMatt I don't have any real advice for you about the cohabitation of perch and trout. I would like to say though that I'm jealous of you for being able to fish a pond with trout and perch.

Aquaman you thought you could hide that link from didn't you....

Look out TR CCs here I come.

Be sneaky.

laughingwatr · 03-04-2008, 08:18 PM

If anyone has more interest in trout here in Nebraska, Daryl sent me this:

Trout reproduction
Quote:
It would be HIGHLY unlikely that there would be any trout reproduction in a pond, it's hard enough to get it in a stream in Nebraska.
We have lots of streams in Nebraska where we have plenty of trout reproduction. That is most true of brown trout, but we have some naturally reproducing brook trout, and even some rainbows in a few places. In fact we have many trout streams where brown trout reproduction is sufficient enough to produce more than enough small brown trout, enough for us to cease stocking trout.

I do not know if you have seen it, but we have a booklet, Trout Fishing in Nebraska's Streams, that has information on all of those streams, what species are there, extent of natural reproduction, public access, etc. If you have not seen that booklet and would like to, I would be glad to put a couple of copies in the mail for you.

Daryl Bauer
Lakes and Reservoirs Program Manager
Nebraska Game & Parks Commission
daryl.bauer@ngpc.ne.gov

P.S. Feel free to share this message with others if you wish.

brademan76 · 03-04-2008, 09:23 PM

I was at the LaVista Cabelas a while ago and they had a screen separating some tiny minnows from the larger trout in the central display. Were these fry from the trout spawning?

suddawg · 03-04-2008, 10:46 PM

I got a copy of that Trout Fishing in Nebraska's Streams booklet. It's a really good read. Highly recommend it.

SudDawg

Fish Recycler · 03-05-2008, 03:52 PM

I'm very surprised to hear of a Nebraska pond where trout reproduction is occurring, particularly if incoming water is strictly groundwater and not a continuous flow stream with a gravel bottom.

If most trout are 12" - 15" and you're not seeing small fish, it really seems to suggest that those originated by stocking and not through reproduction. If reproduction, you should see some 4" - 8" fish as previous year classes.

Even in Washington and Canada, most of the ponds didn't have reproducing populations of trout, even if they were cold and had springs. They'd go into spawning colors and try to spawn, but recruitment wasn't successful. Trout really need a stream.

My guess is that as long as no trout are being stocked, or getting in through some other entry, time will eradicate these fish for you. I could certainly be wrong though, and if you can demonstrate that there are smaller fish in the population and reproduction really is occurring, I'll eat my words.

laughingwatr · 03-05-2008, 06:43 PM

We used to fish a couple of lakes in Manitoba with the non-reproducing trout and some of them got huge. One lake was filled with the water from a smelting plant and they tried to develope spawning habitat at the inlet of the lake. As far as I know they never got any reproduction. We would get one that would push 10 lbs. every once in a while and that was one hell of a fight. If I had a pond with trout and perch I would worry more about the trout than the perch based on the trophy potential and the fight in the trout.

FatMatt · 03-05-2008, 08:14 PM

I guess i can't prove that they are reproducing. The owner of the ponds bought the ground 5 or so years ago and have never done anything as far as stocking them with trout. i just assumed that reproduction was occuring with the number of fish and their size. maybe i was quick to assume there was reproduction... hopefully i have plenty of time this spring to try and see if there are some smaller trout!

TheDude · 03-07-2008, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FatMatt

I guess i can't prove that they are reproducing. The owner of the ponds bought the ground 5 or so years ago and have never done anything as far as stocking them with trout. i just assumed that reproduction was occuring with the number of fish and their size. maybe i was quick to assume there was reproduction... hopefully i have plenty of time this spring to try and see if there are some smaller trout!

Maybe you should just go out there, catch a bunch of them, then give me a call, and rub it in that you are catching fish in those nice spring fed waters that I don't have access to.

FatMatt · 03-07-2008, 10:24 PM

TheDude, both of us have known our who lives that i have always been the better fisherman regardless of access to the great ponds and lakes of the sandhills! its time to let the jealousy go, by the way who caught that pike for you to hold up there...???? just kidding, you will have to come up sometime to catch some fish...

03-02-2008, 08:59 AM	#1 (permalink)
FatMatt Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Atkinson, NE Posts: 12 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	trout and perch There is a pond with both very nice perch...though not many and also has a large number of trout. For whatever reason the owner wants to get rid of the trout and keep the perch in it. My question is, which fish will eat the other if either will? Or do they "cohabitate" without any problems. Any help would be appreciated.

03-02-2008, 09:23 AM	#3 (permalink)
Chad Director Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Gone Fishin' Posts: 6,457 Thanks: 57 Thanked 66 Times in 41 Posts	Welcome to the forum FatMatt! As Bruce said, it would be helpful to know a little bit more about the pond. Things like Bruce asked: 1) Is there any reproduction of either species in this pond? 2) How are fish getting in there - i.e. annual stocking, periodic stocking, or natural reproduction? It would also be helpful to know: 3) What other species (if any) are present? 4) What is the size and condition of the fish now? Generally, it would not be a good idea to have only perch. They could populate to a point that Bruce alluded to where you have an abundance of tiny perch. From what I have read, they can be stocked with most other species. An interesting pond concoction (given you have the right water) might be trout, perch, and hybrid gills. Add feed and enjoy! __________________ *To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.*

03-03-2008, 08:33 PM	#5 (permalink)
Aquaman 2008 Catch & Continue Runner Up Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Midwest U.S. Posts: 858 Thanks: 50 Thanked 34 Times in 14 Posts	Certain trout species are more "piscivorous" than others. Brown trout are notorious for eating other fish. My belief is that in general a yellow perch is more likely to eat a small trout than vice versa. It all depends on the size of the predator and the size of the prey. If you catch a trout or perch of a certain length you can look at the mouth size for a fairly accurate determination of what size fish they can eat. Judging by what you've said, if the trout density is higher, and if both species are reproducing, then the perch evidently aren't making much of a dent in the smaller trout. My gut instinct says that in most ponds where trout reproduction occurs that you could simply harvest trout and control their numbers that way. Keep in mind that both species adapt extremely well to pelleted feed. Do you currently feed them? If not, and you trained them to feed you'd be amazed at how rapidly you could catch the trout using a pellet imitation. If you choose to try this I can give you more information on how to do this. I will provide a link to another forum for you to view many different ways of capturing pellet trained fish. Pellet deceptions - Pond Boss Forum __________________ I'm gonna come at you like a spider monkey! --Texas Ranger

03-03-2008, 10:02 PM	#6 (permalink)
Frosch Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: omaha Certified Youth Fishing Instructor Posts: 1,154 Thanks: 17 Thanked 17 Times in 12 Posts	FatMatt I don't have any real advice for you about the cohabitation of perch and trout. I would like to say though that I'm jealous of you for being able to fish a pond with trout and perch. Aquaman you thought you could hide that link from didn't you.... Look out TR CCs here I come. __________________ I fished open water today.

03-04-2008, 08:18 PM	#9 (permalink)
laughingwatr Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Niobrara River Posts: 121 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post	Trout Reproduction If anyone has more interest in trout here in Nebraska, Daryl sent me this: Trout reproduction Quote: It would be HIGHLY unlikely that there would be any trout reproduction in a pond, it's hard enough to get it in a stream in Nebraska. We have lots of streams in Nebraska where we have plenty of trout reproduction. That is most true of brown trout, but we have some naturally reproducing brook trout, and even some rainbows in a few places. In fact we have many trout streams where brown trout reproduction is sufficient enough to produce more than enough small brown trout, enough for us to cease stocking trout. I do not know if you have seen it, but we have a booklet, Trout Fishing in Nebraska's Streams, that has information on all of those streams, what species are there, extent of natural reproduction, public access, etc. If you have not seen that booklet and would like to, I would be glad to put a couple of copies in the mail for you. Daryl Bauer Lakes and Reservoirs Program Manager Nebraska Game & Parks Commission daryl.bauer@ngpc.ne.gov P.S. Feel free to share this message with others if you wish.

03-03-2008, 07:32 PM	#4 (permalink)
FatMatt Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Atkinson, NE Posts: 12 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Thanks for the info guys! I do know that the trout are reproducing and are able to because of the amount of fresh ground water that comes from underground springs. The trout are all around 12-15 inches or there abouts, and the only perch that i have caught have been some of the nicest perch i have caught, well over 12 inches, i guess i did catch one smaller one. But as far as numbers go, none of us have caught near the number of perch as we have trout, although they are fun to catch and fight like crazy... i guess as a personal preference for all of us that fish the pond we would much rather eat the perch than the trout!

03-03-2008, 10:08 PM	#7 (permalink)
laughingwatr Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Niobrara River Posts: 121 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post	I have a small pond created by a dam on a small stream with gravel beds and whole works and I get no trout reproduction. It would be HIGHLY unlikely that there would be any trout reproduction in a pond, it's hard enough to get it in a stream in Nebraska. A lot of people would be very happy to have a pond that would keep trout. If you would start keeping the trout it would eventually put a pretty good dent in them.

03-04-2008, 09:23 PM	#10 (permalink)
brademan76 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Lincoln, NE Posts: 445 Thanks: 1 Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts	I was at the LaVista Cabelas a while ago and they had a screen separating some tiny minnows from the larger trout in the central display. Were these fry from the trout spawning?

03-04-2008, 10:46 PM	#11 (permalink)
suddawg Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Bellevue (Offutt AFB,) originally Auburn Posts: 248 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I got a copy of that Trout Fishing in Nebraska's Streams booklet. It's a really good read. Highly recommend it. SudDawg __________________ If you kill enough of them, they stop fighting. - Gen. Curtis Lemay

03-05-2008, 03:52 PM	#12 (permalink)
Fish Recycler 2007 NEFGA Angler Of The Year Finalist Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Council Bluffs, IA Posts: 1,295 Thanks: 14 Thanked 45 Times in 24 Posts	I'm very surprised to hear of a Nebraska pond where trout reproduction is occurring, particularly if incoming water is strictly groundwater and not a continuous flow stream with a gravel bottom. If most trout are 12" - 15" and you're not seeing small fish, it really seems to suggest that those originated by stocking and not through reproduction. If reproduction, you should see some 4" - 8" fish as previous year classes. Even in Washington and Canada, most of the ponds didn't have reproducing populations of trout, even if they were cold and had springs. They'd go into spawning colors and try to spawn, but recruitment wasn't successful. Trout really need a stream. My guess is that as long as no trout are being stocked, or getting in through some other entry, time will eradicate these fish for you. I could certainly be wrong though, and if you can demonstrate that there are smaller fish in the population and reproduction really is occurring, I'll eat my words. __________________ You can be a Fish Recycler too...let 'em swim. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

03-05-2008, 06:43 PM	#13 (permalink)
laughingwatr Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Niobrara River Posts: 121 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post	We used to fish a couple of lakes in Manitoba with the non-reproducing trout and some of them got huge. One lake was filled with the water from a smelting plant and they tried to develope spawning habitat at the inlet of the lake. As far as I know they never got any reproduction. We would get one that would push 10 lbs. every once in a while and that was one hell of a fight. If I had a pond with trout and perch I would worry more about the trout than the perch based on the trophy potential and the fight in the trout.

03-05-2008, 08:14 PM	#14 (permalink)
FatMatt Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Atkinson, NE Posts: 12 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	I guess i can't prove that they are reproducing. The owner of the ponds bought the ground 5 or so years ago and have never done anything as far as stocking them with trout. i just assumed that reproduction was occuring with the number of fish and their size. maybe i was quick to assume there was reproduction... hopefully i have plenty of time this spring to try and see if there are some smaller trout!

03-07-2008, 10:24 PM	#16 (permalink)
FatMatt Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Atkinson, NE Posts: 12 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	TheDude, both of us have known our who lives that i have always been the better fisherman regardless of access to the great ponds and lakes of the sandhills! its time to let the jealousy go, by the way who caught that pike for you to hold up there...???? just kidding, you will have to come up sometime to catch some fish...

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