Muzzleloader Bullet Question

[Black Lab 1]

Are any of you familiar with 295 Gr.Powerbelt Copper Series Hollow Point Bullets? I'm thinking about using them this year in my 50 cal inline.

[Hunter]

While you will get some people who swear they get great accuracy out of power belts the vast majority of people get much much much better accuracy out of some type of sabot.
I know my brother dreads having to use the power belts when he heads to Colorado hunting since they do not allow sabots.

I have had real good luck with the the Barnes MZ's and also the Knight EZ Load sabots.

[fishnguy]

Hi BL1,
I normally use Powerbelt 295 gr. Copper Aerotips for deer with good success. I changed to the hp's because they are a little less expensive and I like to practice quite a bit. I shot a nice wt buck this past Dec. at 125 yards. The entry did not hit any large bone mass but when I dressed the deer I found that the bullet had shattered into fragments and the green compression cup was also inside the deer. I also feel the deer went too far after a real good hit (125-150 yds).
This is the only problem I have ever had with Powerbelt products. I have heard that the 270 and 300 gr. Aerotip Platinum's are hard hitters.
www.powerbeltbullets.com

[Hunter]

Here are links to the two I have had good luck with.

Cabela's -- Knight EZ Load Sabots

Cabela's -- Barnes Muzzleloader MZ Sabots

[tjm]

Used to use them. They will bring deer down fine, but I seem to get better accuracy with 250 grain sabot bullet.

[Catfishsteve]

Muzzleloader rifles are very individual weapons, your rifle may like a particular bullet and load, while your buddy's rifle of the exact same make and model won't shoot it for crud.

I've personally had trouble loading the Powerbelts into my rifle. I have a friend who shoots the .45 cal Powerbelts, aerotips and he's had two deer hit right in the pumphouse that I thought went way too far. He's killed others pretty dead though, but one of those deer I witnessesed him smack at about 50 yards and I was not impressed. I'm not sure if what I witnessed was more of an indictment of .45's in general or that particular bullet. Like what you describe, right through the ribs, no bones hit and the deer didn't even act like it was hit for about a minute.

It's hard to get a mz bullet to expand really well, at "normal" deer hunting ranges, save for the Barnes Xbullets type rounds.

Hunters have killed tons of deer with those Powerbelt bullets, no doubt.

Personally, I consider saboted bullets made of solid lead to be superior to jacketed mz bullets, which sometimes act like full-jacketed rounds and just punched holes in deer I've shot with them.

Now, granted, they were BIG holes and the deer did die.

But, I think solid lead gives better performance at longer hunting ranges, than many of the jacketed type bullets I've used. Lead bullets at least expand a little bit at extreme ranges I get antsy shooting at deer when I'm not certain I'm getting at least some expansion. Plus with some of these custom type lead bullets, you can get get far superior BC's in mz bullets over a lot of the jacketed type bullets. This generally lends itself to better accuracy and more retained energy downrange, so again, with solid lead, you should get better expansion at those distances.

Here is a link to some bullets I like.

[Black Lab 1]

Originally Posted by fishnguy

Hi BL1,
I normally use Powerbelt 295 gr. Copper Aerotips for deer with good success. I changed to the hp's because they are a little less expensive and I like to practice quite a bit. I shot a nice wt buck this past Dec. at 125 yards. The entry did not hit any large bone mass but when I dressed the deer I found that the bullet had shattered into fragments and the green compression cup was also inside the deer. I also feel the deer went too far after a real good hit (125-150 yds).
This is the only problem I have ever had with Powerbelt products. I have heard that the 270 and 300 gr. Aerotip Platinum's are hard hitters.
www.powerbeltbullets.com

Am I to assume these bullets don't need to be jacketed? Just open the package and load them?

[elkstalkr]

My opinion. Don't use powerbelts. The are too hollow and they have very thin copper jacket. Most of mine have come apart like a dead grasshopper when hitting solid bone and tissue.

Use Hornady of the stuff packaged by T/C, which is Hornady. OR if you don't mind spending the money use the BEST! Barnes all copper, packaged by Knight.

I shoot Hornady and Barnes now. I suppose those powerboobs would be great for coyotes and praire dogs.

[laughingwatr]

I used the Dead Center bullets and killed 2 antelope and a nice whitetail. The bullets were very accurate but I felt they performed very poorly. All three recovered and they were all basically a cylinder. Now it did kill all three but the deer ran 100 yards and the antelope went about 50. These were 54 caliber.

One thing to try if you have a bullet you like, quit using pellets and load loose powder in varying increments just like handloading rifle cartridges. There is a good chance you will find a load that will work. Also, try shooting groups while cleaning after each shot like each one is your first shot. By doing this I could get the Dead Center to shoot an inch at 100 yards.

One other problem with some ML's is a rough bore. I have an old Rem. 700 that wouldn't shoot anything very well until I spent a lot of effort running bore paste through it to smooth the bore. You may end up with a forearm like Popeye's and your friends may wonder what you've been doing with your free time but your rifle will shoot and clean up better

[Hunter]

Laughingwatr is right about using loose powder. In almost all cases the loose powder will give better results than the pellets and if you are shooting for tight groups cleaning after every shot is a must.

The 2 bullet choices I listed above actually use the same bullet just different sabots. The barnes bullets in tests have proven to be the best for penetration.

[Commando]

Originally Posted by Black Lab 1

Am I to assume these bullets don't need to be jacketed? Just open the package and load them?

[lanenebraska]

Elkstalker makes a great point. The Barnes bullets are a great bullet and are a fail-safe, fully expanding AND pass thru almost every time.

However, the old power boobs will work if you increase the weight to 348 copper or the 338 Platinums and slow them down.

The key to shooting/hunting with powerbelts is to keep your speed between 1400-1000fps. 80g of powder, or one 30g & 50g pellet, will get you about perfect speed. This set-up will be very lethal from 20-120yards. Many folks experience the "Disintegrating" effect because they over-drive them with 100-150g of powder.

One other note, is that alot of Triumph shooters are very pleased with the 250g Hornady SST and 100-120g of powder. The SST is a sturdy bullet and can perform very well at higher speeds

My favorite load for 300g Platinum 45cal PB's is 60g of powder. Never explodes on impact, and usually is just a Boom Flop.

tide

[Black Lab 1]

Lane, for the bullet I'm thinking of using (295 Gr.Powerbelt Copper Series Hollow Point) the guys from Knight suggested I start with loads of 80 gr then work up to 100 gr of loose Triple 7 or FFg to see how and what measurement they perform best.

[elkstalkr]

Originally Posted by Black Lab 1

Lane, for the bullet I'm thinking of using (295 Gr.Powerbelt Copper Series Hollow Point) the guys from Knight suggested I start with loads of 80 gr then work up to 100 gr of loose Triple 7 or FFg to see how and what measurement they perform best.

That might be too hot for a powerbelt. Lane is probably right, slowing them down helps. (or so I've been told)

I used to shoot a 348 grain bullet with 90 grains of loose regular pyrodex and I was STILL getting inconsistent results with them. Some would penetrate, some would come apart like a grenade.

At that point I figured why the heck I am sacrificing velocity for some fall apart bullet (as you can tell I am not a big fan), and switched to bullets that will withstand any velocity.

[Woody_22_Bass]

I shoot a 50 cal CVA inline and in the book it tells me to use 2 50 grain pyr. pellets and 245 grain powerbelts. I refuse to use another bullet out of this gun, I have personally had no problems bringing down deer or had any run to far. My last muzzleloader however would shoot spreads everywhere until I tried just plain lead balls, then I got good spreads and it shot well. I am with steve try different types til you figure out what is working best for you. I also had a guy tell me once that powerbelts are designed and tested for and with cva rifles, how much truth there is to that I have no idea. Powerbelts are great IMO. Woody

[jimbosan]

I use 245gr Aerotip powerbelts and have had absolutely NO problems with them. Put 100gr of 777 behind it and it puts em right down. If I try the 150gr of 777 the bullet goes every which way. I also shoot a TC Omega Z5, love the gun! I can't wait to put my variable scope on it!

[carbonman]

Originally Posted by Black Lab 1

Are any of you familiar with 295 Gr.Powerbelt Copper Series Hollow Point Bullets? I'm thinking about using them this year in my 50 cal inline.

Pasted in below is a review I wrote last winter on the 245 Gr. 50 cal powerbelt. Granted the 295 has a better sectional density, however, it isn't enough better to recommend it. It still has the dead soft lead and the electroplated copper "jacket". You are way better off going to a sabot and true jacketed bullet such as the Shockwave or homogenous bullet like the Barnes.
Date Posted: 12/25/2007

Review:
The performance of these bullets on game is miserable. Low sectional density, pure lead, high velocity, no jacket equals grenade type performance without adequate penetration. Deer #1 this year was a 160 class whitetail buck at 30 yards. Triple 7 in a CVA Magbolt 150. I watched the bullet impact on the shoulder as my 14 year son fired. This deer ran off dragging a front leg. After trailing the blood trail for 610 yards in the snow the trail was lost in a marsh (Jack Sinn WMA). The second deer this year was about a 150 lb doe at 75 yards. The load 3 pellets of Triple 7 in an Omega. The shot blew hair from right behind the shoulder. This doe ran 400 yards leaving a dark red blood trail into a private reserve. Third deer was actually recovered. This was a very large gray faced whitetail doe. Shot placement was high in the chest at the level of the spine. She dropped instantly, however, was still kicking and flopping around to the point where a knife wasn't enough to finish her. After a neck shot she was finished. The first bullet was found in hundreds of fragments in the very front portion of a backstrap and had failed to penetrate the spine. The neck shot looked like a grenade had gone off...similar to the remnants of a prairie dog after meeting a 40 grain launched from a 22-250. Another doe shot at 125 yards with a shoulder shot ran off dragging a front leg. A lucky follow up shot to the head put this doe down. The first shot stopped on the shoulder blade in multiple fragments without making it into the chest cavity. Another large buck, a cull with a single 6 point antler, was squarely hit in the shoulder and sent down instantly. On approach the buck jumped up and ran for over 2 miles before it was recovered. The only one shot kill this year was a 65 lb fawn shot through the high lungs quartering toward the shooter. This bullet failed to exit and was found expanded to over an inch and penetrated only 9" through a doe the size of a Labrador retriever. This is the first and last season we will ever shoot this bullet at game. The only positive side to these bullets is their wonderful accuracy out of a broad cross section of muzzle loaders. No matter if we use loose Pyrodex or Triple 7 or pellets up to 150 grain equivalent, they group better than 1.5 moa. I guess if you reserve these bullets for blackpowder varmint shooting, they are worth the price. The ease of loading and accuracy and great velocities shouldn't tempt you to shoot these at deer.

[elkstalkr]

I agree with carbonman. The load easily and are extermely accurate out of a wide array of guns. To bad the terminal performance doesn't match.

[friggidy]

I shoot a traditional .50 with roundball and patch, the most accurate gun I've ever shot.

[lanenebraska]

I echo carbonman's sentiments. My first 3 years Muzzy hunting I used the 295's in a CVA MagHunter with 100g of APP. Every deer shot(8), the bullet exploded and caused massive damage. Many times 1.5 to 2 front shoulders wasted and turned into scrap Longest shot was 60 yards. Most were 30-50yards.

However, I never lost a deer to a Powerbelt yet. And now I shoot 45cal guns exclusively. When I use PB's, it's always the 45cal 300g Platinum PB. I consider this bullet to be their best offering in sectional density and proven, in real world testing by me.

IMHO, If you are really sold on the 295 PB, then I would highly recommend broadside lung shots only.

Your mileage may vary


tide