Question: 94 s-10 4X4 clutch problems

[Jump n Fish]

Just had a clutch kit put in my 94 s-10 4X4. Got a few different issues after the fact. Since I've had the truck even before, the clutch has always had to hit the floor completely to disengage and it grabs almost immediately as I lift my foot up. I thought the clutch kit would help this, but since a local shop put it in, the problems gotten worse. Its a hydraulic clutch that they said they bleed thoroughly. They told me it would get better after a few miles. Well I've put about 30 miles in town driving on it and its not any better. I've read in the factory manual that its adjusts automatically and there is no manual adjustment to this. Its driveable, but its a pain in the ***** on hills.

Also, its an extremely stiff clutch petal. Probably 50% more force required to depress and they told me this was normal as they put a massive clutch in this small truck.

Also, the thing thats bothering me the most though is how rough it engages. Before, I could be at a complete stop and have no problem slowly letting the petal out without any gas and it smoothly come up to speed in 1st gear. Now, no matter how slow or smooth I try to let the clutch out, it shutters pretty badly when it engages. Once the vehicle is rolling though, it seems to shift fairly normally although I can still feel a good bump when it engages.

Is any of this normal for a new clutch? Will this get better with a little wear on it? I don't really want to take it back to the guys that replaced it, unless I know there is something they can do, or something they did wrong in replacing it. It is a reputable shop, that I've taken a lot of stuff to them in the past.

Thanks for any advice.

[H2only]

if its a cable activated clutch, it has to have some sort of adjustment. If its hydraulic clutch, then I would look into the fluid in the master cylinder or possibly the master cylinder needs a rebuild itself.

For the shuttering, if it shutters like you describe, that is generally a sign of the "throw-out bearing" being bad. Usually clutch kits dont come with a new throw-out bearing, so if you have not replaced it, I would. That will more than likely be the solution to the shuttering.

[Jump n Fish]

It is a hydraulic clutch. The fluid level is ok still. The factory manual says its automatically adjusting, but I'm still suspecting there could be an issue with the master or slave cylinder.

As far as the throwout bearing, I had told them to replace it when they were in there and they claimed they did. I'm suspect of that though, because on the bill, it doesn't list the throwout bearing. It lists the pilot bearing, but the mechanic assured me that the throwout bearing was part of the kit.

I don't know a whole lot about transmissions, but before I took it in the the clutch was shreaking when I would do anything with the clutch pedal. Sometimes it would sit there and just squeal while idling in neutral. I always assumed that would be the throwout bearing. Its now quiet, so if the throwout bearing would normally cause that problem, then I'm sure they replaced it. I'm really not sure what the pilot bearing does though, if that could have caused the squeaking prior to replacement.

I'm going to call them and let them know I'm having some problems with it, and probably get it back to them.

[H2only]

there whole "it will get better" comment is complete bull, it should work properly right away, clutches dont get better, they get worse. for advice when wondering if they actually replace what they say they do, I ALWAYS request to receive all my old parts, whenever I have someone do work on my vehicles.
A good example of this is my friend has a BMW X5, he hit a deer and the body shop charged for all new parts, he got it back and it just didnt look correct. After doing a little "digging" we found that they never even replace the absorbing material inside the bumper, they left the damaged stuff in there and just replaced the bumber cover. After further research on the fix, we found actual cut metal strips, all rivited together to form a brace to hold the "fake" bumper in its place. Needless to say he got an attorney for the whole problem.
If he would have been in a accident after that, there would have no safety at all. The scary thing is they are a reputable popular body shop here in Lincoln, makes you wonder how many others they did this to.

[Jump n Fish]

Originally Posted by H2only

for advice when wondering if they actually replace what they say they do, I ALWAYS request to receive all my old parts, whenever I have someone do work on my vehicles.

I usually do the same thing anytime I go to someone I don't trust. I've developed trust with these guys and know several people that talk highly of the owner and this shop. My best guess is they replaced what they said they did, but a new mechanic can try to cover up his screw-ups without the owner even knowing.

I've done a little more research, and it seems a few different things can cause the shudder. Warped plate or flywheel being one of them. The flywheel was machined and I know they did that because I stopped in when the flywheel was out. Plus it never shuddered with the old clutch, so I have no idea why anything should be warped anyway. They did say to bring it back if I had any problems, so I'll probably do that. I'm starting to wonder if something didn't get put together quite right inside, because I have no idea why it should shudder if they replaced everything they said they did. I'll probably just replace the master cylinder and slave cylinder myself as they're pretty easy to get to, and probably pretty cheap at o'reilly's.

Also something else I've read, is that if they got any oil on the plate or flywheel that can cause the same problem and can take awhile for it burn off. I'll probably call them and let them know there's an issue, but give it a couple more days to see if it smooths out at all.

[Jump n Fish]

Talked to the shop, they said its under warranty for 12,000 miles. They said I could bring it back anytime and they'd see what they could do if it didn't get better in awhile. They said they'd rework anything I needed them to, in order to be satisfied with the job. So I'm not too worried right now.

As far as the pedal being stiff, they said for the size of the clutch in the truck, the master and slave cylinders really are undersized and the hydraulic side of it wasn't designed to really handle a clutch this size. The master cylinder and slave cylinder are a piece of cake on this truck, so I may just change them someday for the heck of it to see if it helps.

[Ty S]

OK the throwout bearing usually does come with the clutch these days.

Did they have the flywheel turned? If so did they have it shimmed back out if they had to take a lot off?

Also you could be just used to your old slipping easily clutch and a new clutch is just works so good your not used to it? Not saying your not feeling anything but this could be whats up.

[Jump n Fish]

The flywheel was turned. Not sure if they shimmed it back out or not, but I wouldn't see any reason to shim it out, as I literally have to hit the floor with clutch pedal to get it to disengage. Shimmed out at all, and I'd be afraid it would drag. My logic could be wrong on this.

I never really had any trouble with the old clutch slipping before, but thats not to say it wasn't worn to the point where it didn't grab a lot softer. I just decided to replace it because my throw-out was making so much noise. The truck has 142,000 on it and I'm pretty sure the clutch hasn't been changed unless the previous owner did so before 90,000 (when I bought the truck).

If I engage it fast enough with enough gas it bumps pretty good, but it doesn't sit and shudder. If I try to engage slowly at all, it will shudder pretty badly. I hope its not something I just have to get used to with a clutch that grabs hard, but I've driven smaller vehicles with new clutches that have never done this. We have a brand new Honda Fit that you can engage slowly without a shudder.

[Ty S]

Originally Posted by Jump n Fish

The flywheel was turned. Not sure if they shimmed it back out or not, but I wouldn't see any reason to shim it out, as I literally have to hit the floor with clutch pedal to get it to disengage. Shimmed out at all, and I'd be afraid it would drag. My logic could be wrong on this.

.

The point of shimming out the flywheel on a hydraulic clutch is that there is no adjustment so this is where it should be from the factory. If it was turned down beyond specs (which happens all the time!) then this could be your problem. Again im not sure though.


What are they talking about with it being "too big" of a clutch for that truck?

[Jump n Fish]

Originally Posted by Ty Stromquist

The point of shimming out the flywheel on a hydraulic clutch is that there is no adjustment so this is where it should be from the factory. If it was turned down beyond specs (which happens all the time!) then this could be your problem. Again im not sure though.


What are they talking about with it being "too big" of a clutch for that truck?

I'll make sure to bring that up when I talk with them about it. As far the "too big" comment, they were mainly referring to the stiffness on the pedal. They said the clutch was too big for the hydraulic release system installed on the truck. Basically saying it needs bigger master and slave cylinders. I don't know if they're just blowin smoke on this one though.

[Ty S]

Originally Posted by Jump n Fish

I'll make sure to bring that up when I talk with them about it. As far the "too big" comment, they were mainly referring to the stiffness on the pedal. They said the clutch was too big for the hydraulic release system installed on the truck. Basically saying it needs bigger master and slave cylinders. I don't know if they're just blowin smoke on this one though.

They are blowing smoke. I had a 1991 and never had any problems with it feeling different.

[Jump n Fish]

Kinda forgot about this, but here's an update on what fixed it. When they decided to break it back open I told them to replace the flywheel and the fork and pivot stud. I read somewhere that the fork and pivot wears out on this truck causing a stiff clutch and loss of travel.

They gave me a new upgraded clutch kit for free under warranty. I bought a new flywheel, fork and pivot. Minus the original cost of turning the old flywheel. All labor was warrantied. Clutch is as smooth as butter now, I've got full travel and clutch is way easier to push in.

I'm very happy with it now, and impressed with them backing up their work as they did. Yeah, it would've been nice if it worked properly the first time, but its not really their fault that carquest jacked up the flywheel although its still their responsibility which they firmly backed up.